Unapologetically You In Business And On Social Media with Devin Brinkley | Episode 91

So obviously, this is a podcast where we talk to women in business about our purpose and our progress that we make along the way.

 

So I’m really curious to dive into how we communicate what we care so, so much about. And to that end, I’d love to know what’s your current trajectory for your vision, for your life, and your business.

 

Good question. I’m actually in like three different business accelerators right now to try to figure that out and nail it down.

 

I really want to work more strategically with people on accomplishing their social media goals as opposed to being so deep in the work itself.

 

So like just really working one-on-one with people, helping them figure out their messaging and provision and their goals, just so that it’s a little more intentional what they’re doing as opposed

 

you just kind of, you know, this is what we’re doing this month and making some content and posting it.

 

So hopefully within the next year or so, I’m moving more away from the hands-on content creation every day and able to work more strategically.

 

Yeah, I love that transition, and I feel like so many of us go through that. I went through that as well.

 

Partly for the intentionality part of it. That’s actually one of my core values, but partly also when I had my first kid, I just wanted to be living more in the strategy realm than the day to day.

 

But I had been finding when I was always in implementation mode, first of all, it was always putting out fires.

 

Everything is urgent, urgent, urgent.

 

I would apply to urgently, and then it would sit in their inbox for one month.

 

And also, I found that people were throwing money at problems rather than having a strategy to drive the content.

 

the solutions that we were doing together. So I would be writing blog posts, and there was no strategy, who was the audience?

 

How did it connect to their bigger picture?

 

What goal does this blog post have? I was really social at one point. I was writing website copy without any strategy to guide it.

 

So I love that you are now implementing more strategy, more attention so that the content you do create can actually do something right.

 

Other than get more views, right?

 

exactly. What’s the next step after you get those views? And so many people come to me and they’re investing in social media because they feel like they have to because everyone else does, but there’s no end game.

 

that’s frustrating and a waste of money.

 

I don’t like wasting people’s money. Yeah, and if the whole goal is impact for you, for them, through each other, then it needs to have that strategy behind it for sure.

 

And then you can feel really good about the impact you make. strategy, you create the content that you co-create.

 

That’s really where all the magic happens is when there’s that intentionality behind it.

 

Exactly, I agree.

 

So what was the one decision or experience that changed the trajectory of your life? it now suddenly being in all these accelerators?

 

Is it something 10 years ago? What’s one thing that really shifted you? So my shift is kind of sad, but it motivates me every day.

 

this was supposed to just be a side hustle for the longest. It was never intended to be my full time day today.

 

But my dad died in 2021 and it was just so shocking and up wrenching. I cannot see myself going back to work.

 

So I ran it by my mom. was like, I’m really thinking about going full time. And she was like, she just said, do what makes you happy.

 

Um, sadly, a month later, my mom also died. And I definitely was like, I cannot go back to work.

 

I was when multi-million dollar budgets and like I just cannot focus plus they only get three days all for each of my parents within a month’s time.

 

Yeah. So I said screw it and I quit my job and that not only changed the trajectory of my business but my life.

 

I was able to work on you know my grief and my healing and getting back into a better place but also spending more time with my kids.

 

Like I volunteer for everything at my son’s school. It’s never something I was able to do before and I just feel like I’m happier.

 

Like this is what I was supposed to be doing all along.

 

Oh that is so so beautiful. Thank you for sharing and I’m so glad that you’ve been able to work on the various parts of yourself in your business, your business outside of your business.

 

That’s what’s so magical about setting those guardrails for ourselves in our own business is that we’re able to be our full human selves.

 

Yes.

 

In it, around it, outside of it, because life is a lot, and our work is something that feels so all-encompassing sometimes, and it’s really nice when we get to decide how it’s woven in, how it’s not.

 

I love that you’re able to show up more for your son and for yourself. Yeah. What a beautiful pivot.

 

Thank you. It definitely obviously was very unexpected, and I was terrified because I was making six figures at the time.

 

Side note, I was also working in healthcare, so I was also pissed that they didn’t, they didn’t think that I needed the additional time all, like it wasn’t printed, and obviously this was still during the pandemic, so mental health was a really big thing, and they just kind of swept it under the rug, but my kids needed me too.

 

Like, they lost their grandparents, and it’s really hard to parent, and… grieve at the same time, so I needed that that space.

 

Oh, yes, and I’m so glad that you were able to make that space for yourself and also find that space and continue to find that space.

 

I mean, you said you’re in three accelerators right now. You’re finding space for yourself. You’re taking up that space and you’re providing space for your clients.

 

I feel like space is a really, really underestimated and underrated thing that all of us need, especially when we do work, we’re so passionate about, or we have life things that are weighing so heavily on us.

 

So, oh, yes, for more space.

 

Yes, definitely.

 

So you’ve had a few iterations of your business and you have an eye to the future of your business.

 

What’s your current elevator pitch, something you’d say at a networking event or as you pop into a Zoom chat?

 

So the name of my business is creative gravity. I partner with women, BIPOC and LGBTQ plus entrepreneurs to cultivate thriving brands and connect them with their audience online using organic social media marketing.

 

Oh, I love the idea of cultivating for me that also nods that like space holding. And I also really like the caveat of organic social because the paid ad game is like a whole other beast.

 

And I think some people when they think of social, they almost only think of the ads. And I’ve actually had a lot of clients who have either been curious about or have been sold, like, okay, just we could put all these ad dollars toward this thing and they don’t know their audience.

 

They don’t know the next step. don’t add a client wants that worked extremely locally. It was local nonprofit, their county funded, they are county event oriented.

 

And they had an ad agency that was saying, Oh, well, we can promise, you know, a 50,000 person reach or something like that.

 

And it was a three county reach. And they’re only aiming to reach their local community. So it made no sense for them to have those ad dollars go to those people who were not perfect fit beneficiaries, clients, funders, anything.

 

So I really love your focus on organic, because yeah, that’s a whole other game that the paid ads.

 

Yeah, there’s a lot of people that still don’t know the difference. And they’re like, what do you mean organic?

 

And I tell them like, organic social media does take more time than, you know, ads and anything that you’re obviously paying for.

 

But it has a higher return on investment because you are connecting with people that share your values that care about what you’re offering, so it increases the likelihood that you’re going to convert them.

 

So that’s why that’s my focus.

 

Yeah, and I think there’s the time and a place for a cash injection or an audience boost or whatever, you know, sometimes we need what we need or we want what we want.

 

But I think at the end of the game, conscious marketing, ethical marketing, it’s a long game. It’s a relationship build.

 

everyone is going to be ready to work with you right now by your product right now. But the fact that they want to be in your orbit is huge.

 

Yeah, we have so many options available to us. So for them to want to follow you want to like or engage or share or whatever, that is such a valuable thing to have at our disposal.

 

And yeah, I put in the social back in social media, I feel like it’s such an important part.

 

All of that. That is absolutely, absolutely true. Some people are like, they don’t understand the importance of the engagement piece.

 

You can have the best content out there. If you’re not doing engagement, you’re nackling to grow. And if you do, it may not be a target audience.

 

people focus on going viral and all these things. You can still viral and get a hundred thousand new followers, but they may have just been interested in that one piece of content.

 

They may not care at all what it is that you’re offering.

 

Yeah, now all of a sudden you have a thousand new people on your mailing list and none of them are the right fit.

 

So then all your emails where you actually do your selling are ending up in spam or your pay for a thousand new subscribers or whatever else, right?

 

virality is not always the goal for most of us. It’s not like, especially, I mean, you and I, we can’t take on a thousand new clients.

 

So why would we want a thousand new followers tomorrow, right? Yeah, so I feel like social media is one of those things that’s one of the most misunderstood because everyone had not everyone, but many, many people have a personal account and have for many years.

 

So they think, well, everyone can do social, right? So what would you tell a stranger, you know, someone at school pick up or at a dinner party, what would you tell a stranger that you do when they ask, okay, so, so Devin, what you do?

 

So it’s actually funny you say that because I got into business, social media, duties as assigned in my, in my corporate job.

 

And I was like, oh, this will be a kickwalk. I had a personal Instagram, I had an Instagram for my dog, like all these things.

 

And then I was like, um, no, like it’s a totally different ballgame. So I would definitely strategically collaborating with businesses to help them accomplish their,

 

business goals. So, it’s definitely making sure that whatever content we’re putting out there coincides with whatever they’re trying to accomplish, whether it’s getting more subscribers on their email list, selling more of this t-shirt, they’re launching a new product.

 

So, not just putting up content out there just to put it out there, but making sure that it actually has, you know, a goal attached to it.

 

Yeah, for sure. That goal is so often overlooked, especially when it’s like, well, you have to post three reels and it has to have trending sound and you have to lip sync and you have to point it, you know, XYZ.

 

I really love the goal focus, yeah. So, on my end, I really want us all to understand and demystify this idea of messaging.

 

So, what do you personally hear? Or what do you personally think of when you hear the word messaging, either for your own business or as you think about it for your clients as well?

 

in the perception that messaging really builds out for us and for our clients.

 

Absolutely, absolutely. I love starting a good conversation on social media.

 

Yeah, I mean, that’s really the goal, That’s sort of the OG intention, I imagine. actually don’t know what the original intention social media was, but that is my hope for any sort of social setting is what sort of exchange can we have?

 

How can we learn from each other? How can we reinforce each other in the best way and connect on those shared values?

 

That’s what all humans need, right?

 

So what is your own brand’s messaging? Especially, I know you’re in flux, so very curious. What’s this process been like, either in the past or even as you work through it now?

 

What’s your own brand’s messaging? So it definitely took some time to one get Obviously, you want to be successful, but if you’re focusing on working smarter instead of harder, it’s less likelihood that you’re going to burn yourself out and increases the likelihood of you accomplishing your goals.

 

And then also being accessible and inclusion are very big to me. I’ve worked with people in the disabled community.

 

Obviously, I work with people and marginalized communities. I think that’s very important to work with people, not just the share your values, but people that are like you, just because you understand them on a different level.

 

And it makes it easier for me to kind of understand them and replicate their voice on social media.

 

That replication piece is really interesting because that all comes back to empathy, right? It’s like really being able to understand how they

 

think and feel how they want to sound, even if they can’t communicate that to you explicitly, right? I feel like brand designers, social media managers, brand messaging strategist, people who have to get things out of their clients’ head and heart and then put it out into the world in a way that matches what was in the client’s brain is really, really tricky.

 

mean, that’s where all the magic is, right? It’s part magic, it’s part science, but having that really deep empathy, either because you’ve had deep conversations with people, you’ve surrounded yourself in spaces that you’re able to take in a lot of different perspectives or because you have shared walks of life, shared experiences, that is such a missing piece that I think is also so, so, so overlooked.

 

And that way, you sound like your client when you’re creating their content, not like whatever their quote, best practice, there is on the internet.

 

Yeah. I think that is such an important piece and that is also the key to connecting with their perfect fit people too, especially if their perfect fit people are similar versions of them, right, past versions of ourselves or future versions of ourselves or whatever it is.

 

It’s funny that you say empathy, I didn’t think about that, but I am a huge empath, which is a gift and a curse because sometimes I do end up doing a little more for people.

 

I get very passionate about their goals and them accomplishing their goals and their businesses growing and things like that.

 

So I get really deep with my clients and it’s always kind of a gift or reward if I do work with someone that doesn’t really understand what they’re trying to say and I present them with something, some type of messaging and they’re like, oh my God, that’s exactly it.

 

That’s always very rewarding to me.

 

Yes, that is my favorite. Yeah, when it’s like, oh man, I never had the words to say that before or I’ve never thought of it that way before.

 

You know, I’ve been I’ve been stewing on this and stewing on this and stewing that, you know, we live and breathe it.

 

We dream it. We do all the things, but like to finally be able to communicate it. Oh, that is magic.

 

Yes. Absolutely is a blessing and a curse. More of a blessing, but also, you know, if we we can’t harness it, it can it can take us for a wild ride.

 

Yeah, that is true.

 

So where were you before you landed on your current messaging? And where are you headed now because of your current messaging, especially again, with an eye on these accelerators, you know, you have to apply to these.

 

You’re doing active exercises in these accelerators. Yeah, where were you before and where you headed?

 

Excellent question. So when I started, I would work with any and everyone. I also was not just doing social media, I was doing a little of everything, I was doing websites and business plans and just wanted to help people with their businesses, but I had no direction or strategy myself.

 

But I very exactly found that I was not happy because I was working with people that did not have the same values as me.

 

I felt like people didn’t necessarily respect me or my craft or my education, my expertise, despite having a master’s degree, they spoke to me a certain way or treated me a certain way.

 

So it actually took me maybe three years into my business to decide that I wanted to specifically work with queer community.

 

They’re just amazing people and I feel like we all all have our own individual unique barriers and the fact that I’m able to not just understand all of those barriers but help them overcome them, that’s super important to me.

 

I definitely want to continue to lean into that more, which is why I’m focusing on having more time to strategically think so you know whether that looks like hiring people to execute the content for me or whatever that may look like I just really want to be deeper into the work and the strategy and the messaging and all those things.

 

Okay that the words that popped out from what you just said, the understanding to overcoming feels so powerful and yeah I just I feel like that is such a cool visual sort of that under and over and then also yeah just so

 

Latable of not only do you understand them, but they’re understanding themselves and you’re Sort of giving them over that hump, but then they’re also overcoming I don’t know.

 

I just think that’s such a really really cool idea And it down. Yeah. yeah, write it down. Yeah, lean into that brain from my nap around that um and then also I think your journey is so relatable Of the I did everything under the sun and now I finally chose a lane and You chose a lane and that lane is also expansive.

 

can now Right just do strategy.

 

You can now hire the implementers You can now do strategy and then implement yourself You can do strategy and then teach your clients how to implement like there are so many routes Even though you’ve chosen a lane It’s still you’re uh boxed in necessarily.

 

It’s just more focused Which feels so so permission giving sometimes when we just feel like we’re pulled in a million Different directions or what we could do a million different

 

things I cannot tell you how many websites I created that I had no business creating or how many social media accounts I managed that I had no business managing and again like I did it better than the clients could do it right but it didn’t mean I was the best person for it it wasn’t exactly in my brain my energy and it sounds like the exact same case for you yes 100 percent I just I was not happy I was burnt out um I felt like I was thinking too hard if that makes sense because it was not my zone of genius and what I’m doing now is not just rewarding but it’s fun um that’s so good yeah so I definitely went to to lean into that more I felt so much pressure to niche down for so long um you know to pick an industry whether it’s weddings or podcasts and I just that didn’t feel right to me so I think that’s also why it took me a while to figure out like I knew I needed to narrow things down but I didn’t want it to be to one specific industry

 

I love that point. That’s such an important reminder that niche doesn’t have to be prescriptive, right? It can be an industry, it can be a type of person, it can be a state of business, I only work with startups or I only work with, you know, businesses that make a million dollars or whatever.

 

But I find the most universally useful way to niche is exactly what you’ve done, which is the type of person you want to be working with, the way they think, the things they value, that for me is sort of like the most instantaneous alignment.

 

And then, yeah, you can choose, I also want to double down on social or on strategy or on XYZ.

 

But I find the fast route, the cheat code version is think about what makes someone tick, what they care about.

 

Does it match you?

 

Great. Start there.

 

Yeah, it’s exactly. I feel like it’s a whole different ballgame and feeling to be able to decide who you work with and to get to the point in your business that you don’t have to accept every single client and be able to turn people away just because you don’t have the same values.

 

Values are super important to me, especially as a woman, as a black woman. It’s just we need to be on the same page.

 

Yeah, you do it for you and for them, right? So actually that leads perfectly into my next question is around sort of what’s this brand building process been like but also how do you figure out what words, what messaging work for you and that they’re actually connecting with your perfect fit people?

 

How do you know where that alignment lives?

 

So the first word… that came to mind was intimidating and scary. I was definitely intimidated to kind of say these are the only types of people that I’m working with.

 

Even though there are businesses that only work with other BIPOC businesses or queer businesses that only work with other queer businesses.

 

But I don’t know, I just felt scared to do it. One, my reach and my income. But once I did it, like, I feel like that’s all I’m attracting is my ideal clients.

 

They are people that I enjoy talking to, enjoy working with. I’ve made some lifelong friends with people that I’ve worked with.

 

So it was a tough, difficult journey. I did hire a business coach to kind of help me figure out, I can figure out other people’s messages and what they’re trying to say.

 

But it’s so hard to do your own.

 

So I definitely want to one of your workshops. And that was extremely helpful.

 

You know, just find the right word or words is so important. And you pointed out just words that I’m pretty sure I got called to be from one of your workshops.

 

Just because it was, I was using something basic like help. And it just, it didn’t really describe how deep and how involved that I’m getting with these businesses.

 

Oh, okay, I love everything about that. Yeah, and actually cultivate literally like stood out to me. So as you were talking earlier at the time of this episode, so I’m so glad that that like still deeply resonates with you.

 

And I’m so glad that you use the word attracting and you use the word enjoying and friendship. like that that is the magic of leading with your values.

 

It is scary. It does. feel limiting in some way. And then when you, when it finally clicks, it feels so, so expansive.

 

So that’s really exciting.

 

100%. Like, why, why did we leave, you know, corporate America or wherever we were working before to work with people that make us miserable?

 

Like, you, it just doesn’t make sense. And that’s kind of where I was in the beginning of my business.

 

And I was like, this doesn’t make me happy. I was getting burnt out. I considered quitting like multiple times.

 

now it’s like, this is what I want to do for the rest of my life.

 

Ah, love that energy. So how do you know your, your perfect fit people for your business?

 

What, what are the clues? That I won’t hate coming to my office and turning all my computer every day.

 

That’s a good one.

 

You have a big green flag that I look forward to, you know, my phone calls with my clients or, you know, creating their content or looking ahead.

 

to the next quarter, um, just being overall happy and comfortable with my skin and, you know, just not dreading the work that I do, not feeling like I’m doing it for a dollar.

 

Like, obviously I need to pay my bills. I, you know, want my kids to be comfortable. But at the end of the day, that’s not my top priority to make money.

 

And I think that speaks volumes, that I’m not just doing this for paycheck.

 

Yeah, because then you could just get a job, if that was the case, right? Exactly. It’d be lot easier in a lot of ways.

 

Um, so how do you integrate your values into your messaging and your marketing? You said how essential it is to how you run your business and how you’re attracting your clients.

 

So yeah, are there any concrete or strategic ways that you really integrate those values?

 

Um, so it’s always a reminder to me to be unapologetically. So authenticity is one of my core values, so for me to be authentic and be me, I have taken off that mask that I wore in corporate America.

 

Just to describe, I have two full sleeves of tattoos. I’ve started a circle on my leg. Nobody knew the real me when I was in corporate America.

 

I wore show up as this tattooed badass woman and people aren’t, you know, if people feel some type of way about my appearance, then they’re definitely not going be the right target audience for me.

 

I also do have a slight potty mouth and I don’t shy away from using that. mean, that’s just me.

 

I don’t want to feel like I have to censor myself on my own social media or my own email list to appease someone else.

 

Like, if that…

 

does not fit you then that’s okay like I respect everyone else’s values this is how I choose to show up this is me so I feel like that’s very free and it’s it’s actually a part of my when I did like my brand guidelines for other people that I work with it does say like don’t be afraid to drop a few F bombs because I mean that’s just the type of person that I am okay I think that’s such an important reminder also as someone who is like the I literally never swear like it just I don’t know what it is I just literally have never said a swear word like in my entire life really but it does not bother me at all to get emails watch TV shows be in conversation with people who swear and so that’s a really good example of like not same same but still somehow being aligned right like you could still absolutely have a client

 

doesn’t have green locks, who doesn’t have tattoos, who doesn’t swear, but like something inherently is the energy that you bring.

 

The fact that you’re showing up is you’re full of self, giving permission to them to show up as they’re full of self, whatever that may be, you don’t have to be the exact same as all your clients.

 

You just have to have that mutual respect, mutual understanding.

 

Yes, that you said that perfectly and that’s all it is. Like I’m not expecting people to show up and be just like me.

 

If they are, that’s super cool. But I have met plenty of amazing people like you that, like you said, they understand and they respect me for who I am.

 

I love that and that’s what I love about what I do and the people that I’m attracting by being myself.

 

Yes, love that. And I really do think that this theme of permission keeps coming up in my life, my personal life and my work life.

 

I’m reading a book right now about perfectionism and it’s like pro-perfectionism. I would have a whole podcast about this.

 

Yes, borderline life-changing. It’s called a perfectionist guide to losing control and it’s basically like perfectionism can be wonderful. There are, you know, she calls it maladaptive sides, but it could also be, you know, something, it’s not going to change, so you can lean into it or it can hurt you and you’re in the way.

 

don’t have to read that. Yes, and just, you know, I’ve had a lot of like personal struggles the past few years and I’ve finally shared it with friends and it has given them permission to share their struggles that I would have never known about.

 

And the same was showing up online and just being your fullest self, it shows other people, oh, this could be safe for me to do too, especially if I only surround myself with people.

 

Do you Who see me?

 

I’m so glad you said that. That’s another thing like I, to present myself as a safe space. A safe space for, you know, people that are going through things.

 

I’m very vocal about mental health. Obviously, you lose both of your parents suddenly. You may have a few mental health issues.

 

And I’m very, I talk about that all the time. have a crop ton of chronic illnesses. Like, I have a lot of stuff going on with me.

 

And I’m like, if you need to sit down and walk away for day, you know, you are having bad mental health day, whatever the case may be, like, give yourself permission to do that.

 

Or if people just need to vent to me, I am not safe space. I want to be here for you.

 

It doesn’t always have to be business that we’re talking about. Yeah. Yeah, I think that’s so important. And I think that’s a big differentiator in human first business versus, you know, dollar first business.

 

For sure. Yeah. So, I mean, you just gave an example, of take, let’s have a non-business conversation. rotation or take a mental health day, but what are some values aligned decisions that you make beyond your copy content conversations beyond the marketing realm?

 

Any values aligned decisions that you make that you want to share?

 

Be on the marketing. Um, I would definitely say like, um, for instance, um, groups that I participate in. Um, places where I do business myself, whether it’s a business owner or personally.

 

Um, for instance, I just did a brand shoot last week and I was a very intentional with the people that I selected.

 

Um, so obviously my brand shoot is going to be a representation of my business, but I wanted to make sure that I was working with vendors whose values aligned with minds.

 

And I feel like that helped, uh, the, the deliverables or I can’t talk come out the way that I wanted to and they all.

 

nailed it.

 

Like from the makeup artist to the studio that I worked with, to the girl that colored my hair, all of it.

 

Like they nailed it.

 

Oh, love that. Yeah. And I mean, where are we spent our money is one of the biggest, yes, most impactful values of line decisions we can make.

 

So yeah, absolutely, who we hire and where, yeah, just where we choose to send those dollars that we spend so much time and energy earning is really, really important.

 

Yes. And I also, um, I do have a couple of contractors that do work with me right now. They mostly focus on engagement, but I do make sure when I am hiring, I’m very clear about my values up front too.

 

Um, just because I don’t even want to get to like the interview process and people are, you know, we’re both shocked that we’re so far apart.

 

Like, I want you to know up front, these are my values.

 

These are type of people that we work with. And, you know, if that doesn’t jive with you, then you can keep it moving.

 

Yeah, and I mean, I can’t imagine hiring someone and not sharing your values up front because it would be so misaligned for them too, like it wouldn’t feel good for them to work with someone who doesn’t align with their values.

 

So I just don’t understand why more people don’t share their values up front. I understand the fear of, you know, scaring people away, but also why would you want people in your orbit who don’t see and understand you?

 

Exactly.

 

So what would you love to feel more confident about in your messaging, in your brand in general? Or when you feel tongue tied talking about your vision, is there anything you do to feel more confident in it?

 

The only thing that saw I’m actually a huge intro, like… a major introvert. I have social anxiety and everything.

 

I would love to be able to show up more in person. I appear very confident online. When I get in a room with people, I’m the type that will sit in a corner and not say anything to anybody.

 

I’ll be on my phone. And I think if I could be more confident in person, that would do wonders for my brand because I am very outspoken.

 

I am bold. I love being kind of that personality, but I struggle with doing it in person. And I think that would kind of help me go to the next level, especially since so much has gone back to in person.

 

So that would definitely be good for me. And when I do get tongue tied and stuff, which happens a lot, actually, I do try to be, I do try to consider the audience and the people that I’m talking to.

 

But at the same time, I I’m not going to apologize or be like, I’m not offending anyone. I’m not saying anything like that.

 

So I’m not going to be apologetic about what I’m saying. Um, Yeah.

 

Uh, yeah, it is so amazing how different it is to write and or be able to edit to heaven versus having to just like speak.

 

Yeah.

 

Exactly. So different. And yeah, and maybe it’s an introvert thing. Maybe I don’t know what, but, um, yeah, it is pretty amazing how we can feel confident, you know, typing something out or again, you know, being able to edit out every single, um, video or something like that versus, you know, having to show up and be human, in front of another human.

 

Right. Yeah. You are absolutely not alone in that.

 

I’m not sure you’re most vulnerable state. I mean, because like you said, there’s no editing, you show up as you are.

 

And I would say that took me A little bit of time to get comfortable with too, but in the last few years, I’m just like, you know, this is me This is what you get.

 

So I may say I’m twenty three hundred times.

 

I’m sorry, but that’s just me thinking probably Yeah, yeah, and we all we all have our things right our hang ups and everything else So we can always keep working on it.

 

We can always make progress, but also, you know, we are here now, so So, okay, on the social media front, what’s something you wish you had known about social before you got started?

 

I mean, so much has probably changed, but just yeah, just either social media or Yeah, like showing up online anything that you wish you had known Yes, there are a lot of things that I’ve learned along the way one Social media is intense and takes a ton of time like in the beginning I would say it was more fun and you know as I was learning

 

But the more that I learned, it is time consuming, and it takes a lot of time, lot of brain power, it’s draining.

 

Like I love what I do, but it is exhausting mentally. So that’s definitely one thing and how important self-care is as an entrepreneur, like it is an absolute must.

 

Now, I do bi-monthly staycations, and that’s just to get away and be able to think about non-work stuff and decompressed, even if it’s just in the country somewhere with my dog doing nothing, like that’s very, it’s critical, it’s imperative to me.

 

And then I would say how intimidating social media was in the beginning, there’s all of 2 million followers and all of that in the beginning, like everybody, well, at least I did.

 

It’s fire, like I felt like that. that’s what I had to do. But it’s not as easy as people make it seem and a lot of it’s fake.

 

And I didn’t know that in the beginning. But if you look at some of those people that have millions of followers and then you look at their content and see how many likes and comments they have, the math, not math.

 

So those people either are not real or it goes back to another one of those viral moments where they attract it tons of people that are not their ideal clients.

 

So that’s not going to make you any money.

 

Okay, I love all of those reminders. First of all, the self-care is imperative, especially as a mama. Just as a human, but especially the mamas.

 

And yeah, the idea of followers don’t make you money necessarily. And even the idea of being intimidated, I just saw a thread recently that was, I want to say throw me a tantrum.

 

That’s not the right word. She was complaining about how clients or prospective clients were judging her for having a small following.

 

And she was giving the analogy of, you know, it was you wouldn’t judge a midwife by how many kids she has or something like that.

 

Or you wouldn’t. Oh, it was some other example of like, of course you would never judge any other expert by their, but like the status of what they do.

 

And I even think, especially like the healthcare industry, how many doctors and nurses are so clearly unhealthy.

 

I don’t know.

 

And I don’t think that means that there are any worse at, you know, diagnosing or treating you necessarily. And you even said some at some point during this conversation.

 

Nailing our own messaging is so hard. are so close to it. So you don’t have to have 3 million social media followers to be able to successfully operate and strategize around someone else’s social media platform.

 

I think that’s a really important reminder for all of us.

 

Yeah, that’s an excellent point. It’s definitely a rant that I’ve gone on multiple times, especially in the beginning when I just had, you know, I mean, I still only have maybe 2,500, 2,700.

 

I don’t know because I don’t even have any attention followers. But in the beginning, people were like, how are you going to help me when you only have X amount of followers?

 

And I was like, yeah, I might have 300 followers, but I’ve worked with half of them, know what I mean?

 

Or I’ve connected with half of them. So kind of the analogy that I’ve used is, have you ever gone to the nails salon to get your nails done?

 

Have you looked at your technician nails? Their nails look like crap. Or the hairdresser that you go to, their hair is in a ponytail.

 

Just because, you know, they are not taking care of their own appearance, that doesn’t mean that they can and, you know, execute yours, typically we are pouring into our clients more than we’re pouring into our own socials.

 

And that’s exactly, you know, with those people, if I did 12 hands of nails a day, I’m not going to want to do my own.

 

Mm hmm. Yeah. Uh, it’s such an important reminder. I, yeah, and I think with a grain of salt, right?

 

Also, we want to, I don’t know, it is so hard to prove our chops, right? that’s what I feel like vibe is just so much more important.

 

That’s why referrals work so well. That’s why having whether it’s your favorite social platform or your website or your newsletter or some sort of home turf, like a podcast somewhere where you can continually show up and show who you are, gives them such a better sense than, well, they say they do X and Z.

 

I don’t know.

 

I don’t know how to differentiate between them and anyone else who calls themselves that same time. it’s really, really hard to choose who we work with.

 

So yeah, I think our values and our personality and our vibe are so, so essential to showing how we’re different.

 

I agree 100%. 100%. And that’s how I pick a lot of my own service providers, their vibe, or their overall aesthetic.

 

Like if it just looks, there’s people that show up and they just make, you know, what they do look so out of reach and unattainable.

 

And that’s not really the type of person that I want to work with. Like what I do isn’t that easy, but I want people to know that it is doable.

 

So that’s how I try to show up.

 

Yeah, I think that’s super important that nuance there. So what’s one tactical tip that you can share about social media that will save, especially multi-passionate deep thinkers, time or money or energy?

 

I think the biggest thing is energy. actually just did a presentation for… or an introvert summit that’s coming up and my focus was energy mapping because as an introvert or just a business owner period, like all of our batteries drain at some point.

 

So it’s very important that when you are making content, you’re doing it when you are higher energy. So the actual executing, making reels, writing captions, taking pictures, whatever the case may be, do it when you’re high energy.

 

You know, if you’re a morning person or a night owl, you know, if by the end of the week, you are absolutely over it.

 

So maybe you should be doing it early in the week. Just pay attention to you and your energy. And that’s when you should be focusing on making content.

 

And when your energy is a little lower, that’s when you should focus on doing engagement or maybe a little planning or, you know, that’s not so labor intensive.

 

And then A lot of people feel pressure, they have to be on every social media platform where they have to post every day.

 

Those things are not sustainable. They’re not realistic. I myself probably post three times a week. You figure out what number is achievable and sustainable for you.

 

And if that’s twice a week, then that’s what you do. As long as you’re showing and doing it consistently, that’s all that matters.

 

OK, that question of energy is so important. And I feel like business is the ultimate mirror. It’s the ultimate introspective exercise because we are just constantly put on fast.

 

We’re constantly faced with all these decisions and all the time. Yeah. the more that’s why I’m obsessed with almost I shouldn’t.

 

I try not to say it best because I anyway, but I am very, very into personality tests and really into any gram.

 

I have gone deep down the women late diagnosis. ADHD rabbit hole. I really, really have been focusing in my 30s on getting to know myself better, how my brain works, how my body works, so that I can then show up and do what I need to do.

 

And so I think that paying attention to your energy is so important. I’ve also heard for a lot of people who menstruate, cycle-sinking can be really, really beneficial.

 

It doesn’t work for me because whole other issues, but I like love that idea. But yeah, really paying attention to your body, your energy flows, especially when you can control it around child care or child, or like other caregiving or other people’s constraints on your schedule.

 

I think that is such a powerful tool that we have.

 

And it’s funny you say that too. Same. I have delved into learning more about myself these past

 

years.

 

I’m very neurospicy, which I’ve always suspected, but it’s come from the past few years. So obviously looking into resources that can help me with that.

 

I love body doubling. That’s probably the best thing for me in my ADHD. I’m able to accomplish so much.

 

I know I cannot work when my kids are here. I absolutely cannot. So I do most of myself when my youngest is at school or after he goes to bed.

 

So my day may not look like everybody else is. It’s not a nine to five. I might be working at 10 11 o’clock, but that’s what works for me.

 

So don’t feel like you have to do, you know, what everybody else is doing. Everyone’s different. Everyone’s body mind life is different in some type of way.

 

And it comes in waves too, right? You mentioned product illness earlier. That is a huge determinant on how our days go.

 

I am in the thick of very, very young children, and I choose not to put them in care. time or even close to full time.

 

So that is a big driver of my day. you know, sometimes, yeah, we just have ambitious streets or we have life streaks that hit us hard.

 

And, yeah, of course, we still have to show up. We still have to make money. We still have to be there for our clients, but it does not have to look and sound and feel like anyone else’s journey.

 

Nope, not at all.

 

Yeah. So as we wrap up, what is a message that matters to you about life, about business, about anything in between?

 

I think it’s just always important to be yourself, and that sounds so cliche, so basic, but you have to be true.

 

to yourself, honor who you are. I feel like it’s a true disservice to you, your values, just everything if you are showing up as someone or something you’re not.

 

So that’s why authenticity is one of my core values.

 

Yes, and it is basic, but also in a world where we’re just told to conform, conform, conform, conform.

 

Exactly.

 

an important reminder.

 

Exactly.

 

So is everyone, is just loving what you’re saying.

 

They want to connect with you more. How can they stay connected? My website is creativegravityllc.com. Same on social media, on Instagram, I’m Creative Gravity LLC.

 

And on LinkedIn, I’m Devin Brinkley.

 

So I’m only on Instagram and LinkedIn right now, because it’s just too much going on out there. Yeah. Well, all of those will be linked in the show notes.

 

And Devin, thank you so much for it. just lovely conversation.

 

Thank you for having me, Ashlee.